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Thread: Is Bob 21 T3?

  1. #16
    Join Date
    Sep 2017

    Default Bosox vs Freighter

    Bosox, we’ve hashed this out before and I still don’t get either your or kj’s point. I know what you’re referring to. It was on blackjack info and I asked Kj his opinion on if he thought Joe’s story on GWAE podcast was believable. Since my handle is different on blackjack info, Kj didn’t know I was Bob21 when I asked this question.

    Really? That is what Bosox is so upset about? Again, not a big deal...unless you're a drama queen.

    I didn’t believe the story because Joe said he maREallyde $500,000 in six months starting out. This didn’t sound believable. He made several other claims that didn’t sound believable, like playing with a dealer that delt 700 rounds per hour. He sounded like many APs I’ve known who are prone to exaggeration. Kj listened to the podcast and said he bought Joe’s story. Then he somehow found out I was Bob21 on this site and went off on one of his rants saying he’d have answered my question differently if he’d have known who I was.

    Reading or listening to crap like this is not good for the everyday player. You're a bright guy so you can easily separate fiction from reality. Many can't, including some who work in a casino.

    This is what I don’t get with APs. Why is their answer different depending on who asks a question. This makes no sense, but I guess in the AP world it does. Who knows? I wonder if Kj gives different answers to the question what is 2 + 2? Is his answer different depending on who asks that question?

    Yes. Get used to it. AP stands for arrogant prick. Have you ever met an "AP" who was not an expert on every subject...and NEVER wrong?

    Bosox, since you and Kj are buddies you’ve never forgiven me for asking a question with a different handle. You have a very strange opinion of what is right or wrong. Having a different handle on different sites is the worst thing someone can do in your book. That’s who you are. I don’t understand it, but after being on these forums for a while I get this is how you think.

    IF you're going to such extreme as to try to control what is beyond your control. Hence, different handles on different sites. Then don't just stop at Bob. What about KJ/Spiderman? Flash/about 18 handles? 21Forgay/The Refinery? Now Bosox seems to imply he has more power than just a poster. That's not the Norm. Or is it?

    So Bob, I get it. You like to debate and you're good at it. But Freighter has game, knows he has game, and is damn good at his game. Plus he flat out doesn't give a rip. For whatever reason, you got on his bad side. Better you than me. I'm just saying, consider picking your opponents more wisely for your game of debate. Freighter's standard answer when even close to cornered is "o ya? Well, fuuuuuck you!" That's not a bad thing. Actually a good thing! Hmmm, who else has been known to do that?

    Bosox writes to SkinnyBJplayer/Flash: Nice post, very informative. Welcome back.

    Perfect timing. A fastball right down the middle of the plate. As Adrian said to Rocky. YOU CAN'T WIN BOB! The forum game is rigged.

    Last edited by Moses; June 12th, 2019 at 09:29 AM.

  2. #17
    Join Date
    Sep 2017

    Default Bob writes:

    Why do APs take things so personally when someone doesn’t agree with them. Why does Bosox make such a big deal over nothing? These are the mysteries in life that we’ll probably never understand.
    You couldn't have stated it better if you spoke through a burning bush. Amen.

    I won't write The End because it's not likely. But it would be nice if Bosox would come clean and explain his logic.

    Bosox writes: Bob, "I might as well mention Moses as well as he responded to the above quote" once again Bob you have given the wrong story that I was referring to

    What is the correct story?

    and frankly I could care less as it is in the past tense.

    No. You opened the door. Please direct Bosox to answer the question Norm, Your Honor.

    On a side note, Bob, you are having a lot of cruel fun at Zee's expense and frankly I don't think Moses or anyone is finding it enjoyable. The real asshole is you Bob.

    To say Zee is a unique individual would be an understatement. No, if I had to bet, I'd go up to -139 that Bob doesn't give two poops about Zee's trips reports. But Zee has brought just a wee bit on himself. No? Zee is far smarter than he let's on in a forum. I question if Zee is even a real person. Hell, Zee might be Bob.

    It seems, without controversy, there is no forum. Zee certainly creates controversy. Hell, I remember waking up one morning a few years ago thinking about solutions to Zee's questions as opposed to my own. YOU got me Zee.
    Last edited by Moses; June 12th, 2019 at 06:46 PM.

  3. #18
    Join Date
    Sep 2017


    Interesting posts by Bob21, KJ, and Bosox.

    Steve Prefontaine once said, "to hell with run for my country, I'm running for me." Don S probably remembers the exact words. But I'm close. Anyway, he took all kinds of shit from the media for that statement. Mind you, in order to maintain his amateur status, he was given a mattress to put on a floor and hot dogs to eat so he could run for our country.

    So I say, to hell with newbies. I'm running for me. Point is, my race can end on a moments notice. Hence, there is little or no reward to helping a newbie and it carries a huge amount of risk. They will figure it out. The products offered today are far more helpful than 3 decades ago.

    The main thing is stop exposing what you do to casino personnel. THAT is karrazzeee! Sorry Bob, that includes trip reports. Most casino personnel don't believe any money can be made by superior play. Prove them wrong? You get banned. They are already twitchy and pissed off. I can't say as a I blame them. They read of players travelling the country making fools out of pit bosses and EITS to make six figures annually. In the meantime, they dedicate themselves to a family and struggle along making $50k a year. I'd be pissed and somewhat territorial too.

    If you lose? Be gracious and thank them for the game if you must say anything. IF you win? Say nothing and walk away quietly. NO NEED TO BROADCAST EITHER ON A FORUM.

    Bob writes; I came to Zee’s defense since he made an excellent point (his point was basically play within casino tolerance so you don’t get kicked out) and I could see you, Freightman and 21forme were attacking him for no other reason than because you enjoy attacking him. It’s the same reason bullies like to put nerds down in school. It gives them a feeling of superiority.

    Please go back and read this thread on BJTF. I stayed on topic and you and your gang were off on tangents, just looking for someone to ridicule and make fun of. That’s not how I’m wired. Bosox, I’m sorry to hear this is how you are wired.

    Bob. Ever watch those old Starsky and Hutch episodes. No one can ever remember which one is which. It's the same thing with 21Forme and Zee. "Snitch and Snatch" have been going at it for years. I admire you sticking up for the underdog. But Norm needs to end their little thang...and should have at least 3 years ago.

    BTW, Bob. If you read back far enough? You'll see Zee loves catching shit for his posts. Almost as much as APs love giving it to him. It's a big part of BJTF.

    Maybe Midwest Player should take a poll as to whether it's Ridiculous or Necessary. No?
    Last edited by Moses; June 12th, 2019 at 09:51 PM.

  4. #19
    Join Date
    Sep 2017


    I went back and listened to this part of Joe’s podcast again. Here’s a couple of red flags in that story. This casino did not bring in “super dealer” to counter measure Joe. Joe went to the manager and requested this dealer and paid them so much an hour to deal to him. Who does that? I’ve never heard of a person going into a casino and paying a casino to have “super dealer” deal to you. Joe then had a pit boss come over to his table and time him so he could determine how fast he was dealing. It sounded like Joe had the whole casino working for him.

    Most card counters want to stay under a casinos’s radar and not bring attention to themselves. Joe did the opposite. He wanted the whole casino to watch his play, and, in fact, requested “super dealer” to deal to him. Joe never said if he paid the casino to make sure no other players were at the table.

    Joe also said nothing about pen. Kj, I agree with you, usually a casino will reduce pen if they think you’re counting. It doesn’t sound like this happened to Joe. Joe never said how much he made at this casino but it sounded like he cleaned their clock, which made no sense.

    No casino is going to just gonna sit back and let you play as they watch chips pile up in front of you. They might not know what you’re doing, but they aren’t going to just stand back and take a beating. At some point they are going to back you off. It didn’t appear like Richard believed much of this part of Joe’s story either. Richard had a hard time believing the 700 rounds per hour part was even possible.

    Joe was the person who mentioned this dealer is usually at the casino as a countermeasure for counters. But this was NOT the reason Joe was playing against him. Joe was playing against him because he requested to play against...and, in fact, paid the casino to play against him.

    This is only one example of one of his stories that didn’t add up. There were many many others. At one point, Joe said there are just the right amount of counters around, implying that’s why blackjack is a good career. How would Joe know what “the right amount of counters” are? As an AP, I know the fewer, the better. This was a stupid statement, saying “there are just the right amount of counters.”

    You could tell a lot of Joe’s statements were self-serving and advertisements for Blacjajck apprenticeship. Colin was with Joe constantly putting plugs in for blackjack apprenticeship.

    Kj, each person is entitled to their opinion. If you believe Joe’s story that’s your call. As for me, I believe the majority of it was exaggeration. I don’t believe he made $500,000 in six months his first year playing bj, or that he played against a dealer who could deal 700 rounds/hr.

    Bob, I'm glad you took the time to go back and listen to this podcast. Thank you. I have neither the time, nor the inclination to do so. If people believe such nonsense, that is their prerogative. I only hope casino personnel is not buying into it.

    My only question is, even if he did it, why tell about it? For instance, you're probably a good guy and would be interesting to visit with on many levels. But I'm not going to tell you what I do in a casino, so you can tell others. There are already enough peoples asses is leather seats. If the seats were all full, which seems to be the mission of APs, where are they going to play? IF everyone has game and makes EASY MONEY which also seems to be the mission for camps, there will be no game to play. Shrewd!

    Did you know that just about everyone I talk to in a casino is a winning player? Also, if I'm willing to invest my time to sit and listen to them, they will teach me everything they do which is far more than I want to know. FOR FREE. What is wrong with this picture? I often wonder how in the world casinos can afford to stay in business. Nobody ever loses.

    I wouldn't know Colin from Barney Fife. But he has followers with dreams of grandeur and making easy money that seems to be growing. He also has some casino personnel scared shitless. The is NO easy way to make money in this game. It requires WORK just like any other job. Actually, sports betting is far easier because it doesn't require my ass in seat. Maybe set up sports betting camps. Wait, that would drive the odds down. No?

    As you know, my opinion of forums is they are congeniality contests. You also know, I could care less about that stuff. But Don S and Freighter separate themselves from the rest of the pack. It's their WORK ethic!

    I do believe he built a contraption to be able to pee in his car.

    O brother. When I was his age, I more concerned about how much puntang I could catch. If I had to go? I went! As one gets older the thought process does change a little bit. Don't drink 30 minutes before you leave the casino. Pee before you leave. Repeat when you arrive at home. Of course, according to KJ who thinks he has researched me, and Bosox who has a crystal ball, I could simply walk to and pee off the nearest bridge. Joe will probably sell this contraption and become a millionaire.

    Dog Hand writes: I've been "trespassed on first offense" (TOFO'd) more than half-a-dozen times, but I'm reluctant to name names, as the casinos might then be able to associate my handle with my name.

    Here is a big name poster. Evidently, he believes casino personnel frequently read these forums. True or not. Why take the risk?
    Last edited by Moses; June 13th, 2019 at 10:13 AM.

  5. #20
    Join Date
    Sep 2017


    KJ writes:
    Damn it Bob. You seem to have the same reading comprehension issues as another banned from this site troll.

    One doesn't need strong reading comprehension to see that you're running your mouth when you should be closing it. IF it takes getting banned to shut you up? Then so be it. However, you have improved considerably recently. Point is, a PRO as you consider yourself, should be concentrating on his game as opposed to such nonsense as JOE.

    Another of these countermeasures or warning signs is a pit critter coming over to the table and flipping through the discard tray to see if many small cards had come out. Some of these things are as much about just seeing what the players response is.

    Take the reduction in penetration for example. Pit walks over and whispers in the dealers ear.

    Just once, consider that is not ALWAYS about you the PLAYER getting the red carpet and what YOU want/expect it. For instance, suppose you make a large bet and the dealer drops you back to 50% pen. Maybe, just maybe the dealer is doing you a favor by sending a nonverbal message you are both under watch. Perhaps the worst thing for a dealer is to have the pit boss walk over and whisper in their ear. They should already know. No? And the pit boss who walks over? Is probably covering his own ass.

    Therefore, to consider this podcast has any relevance whatsoever is ludicrous. You, as a "PRO" should already know this without giving it any thought...and be damn pissed off about those promoting their service, essentially at your expense. The "only" thing that would interest me is the "pee in the car" device. And that's only if Wyoming fills up with housing like California and I find myself driving cross country. In other words, IT doesn't.

  6. #21
    Join Date
    Sep 2017


    The REfinery writes:
    Call me paranoid but I'm not really into giving out my spread on the internet. I'll only say that I got way more heat as a low roller than a high roller.

    Bob writes:


    Good one Bob.

    Bob writes:
    For me, this is the most convincing evidence it didn’t happen. It makes no sense someone would find this powerful of a play and only milk it for 3 million in five years. Heck, some of the BJA group makes this kind of money playing Hilo (with a 1.5% edge) in a couple years. If you don’t believe me listen to some GWAE podcasts.

    It also made no sense that Rob would have made the same amount each year. Since this bug was so easy to find (I mean two retards found it while drunk) you’d have thought he’d have made that much the first year knowing at any time it could go away.

    Are these the same drunk retards (Bosox and 21Forgay) who think KJ can walk on water? Bob...that LAKE was Frozen.

  7. #22
    Join Date
    Sep 2017


    Moses, I’ve been busy lately at work so haven’t had much time to respond but I have been checking in on Zenzone. Thanks for appreciating my one liner (really one sentence) response to Refinery, when I said “paranoid”. I couldn’t resist but figured most wouldn’t get it. Glad you did.

    I figured you'd been debating somewhere that your were actually getting paid for it.

    I wanted to respond to Bosox but was scared Norm might delete my post. But I liked the post Bosox made about me always checking in on zenzone. And he was dead on! I check in on Zenzone at least 3 times a day. I really like your material even though I don’t always comment on it.

    A thought. You might ask Freighter's viewpoint on the Moses threatening KJ as Bosox put it. What a couple of drama queens! 21Forgay had me on ignore when I was at BJTF. Clearly, he's afraid of confrontation. Now, that I can't respond, he won't shut up. lol

    You’ve made some really high quality posts lately....made me laugh, and made sense at the same time! Good stuff!

    Thanks. I've been doing some homework on my game for the last few days. The work is boring as hell. But it has to be done. So I take make breaks and see what the muskequeers are up to. They never change. New drama's but always the Queens.

    Poor Bosox. HE just gets on one side of the fence and they change sides. Thus why I don't try to pick sides.
    Last edited by Moses; June 19th, 2019 at 09:10 PM.

  8. #23
    Join Date
    Sep 2017

    Default Boberino asks some highly classified questions:

    I've got the answers:

    In the end, it really doesn’t matter. People can believe what they want. I mean there are still people out there that believe Big Foot is real. Does that effect me? No.

    It would if he poked his head inside your tent in the middle of the night. That'd be downright rattle some. No?

    Hey, some people still believe in Santa Claus

    Well, Karl's grandma was actually ran over by a reindeer. She was walking home from our house Christmas Eve. Karl, hollered "whydgya hit my grandma fer, whydgya hit my grandma fer." Well Karl was kickin up one helluva fuss over the deal. You know, making a clatter. So this here big feller with a white beard wearing a red suit turned around to see what was the matter! Karl hurled a lawnmower blade straight at him cause he was so pissed. Some folks call it a a Kaiser blade, I call it a lawnmower blade um ha. He caught that feller right between the eyes and damn near took his head clean off. Karl couldn't remember the number for the police 9-1-1. Anyway, that's what happened to that Claus dude.

    and the tooth fairy.
    Only if KJ decides to go to dental school.

    People, including Mickey, are free to believe whatever they want. It sounds like this is very important to Mickey. It’s become his cause. In fact, I think it’s good he’s found something that gives his life meaning.

    Wait, now hold on just a gall dern minute cheer. You mean to tell me Mickey is NOT Big Foot? RS can breath easy now.

    Remind me to tell you about the time we had a bobcat in our backyard.

    Back to work.

    KJ writes: I wish you wouldn't draw those lines of "Mickey's camp" and "kewlj's camp". That is not what it is....at least to me.

    I agree Bob. It should be the "ultimate shit kickers camp" vs the "queen queertards camp. To quote Don S. What is wrong with you!

    Now, back to work.
    Last edited by Moses; June 21st, 2019 at 08:56 PM.

  9. #24
    Join Date
    Sep 2017


    Oh no, not the “block”! Lol. Mickey are you really going to give another member the “block”? Some call it the “ignore”. I haven’t been an AP long, but I’ve learned this is the most server punishment one AP can do to another. It’s almost equivalent to the death penalty.

    And now gullible Mickey has put someone else on “block”. Say it isn’t so Mickey. I’m still trying to recover since Mickey put me on ignore or block or whatever. It’s one of the most traumatic things that has ever happened in my life. And now Mickey is doing it to someone else. That’s cruel, but I guess Mickey knows best. Hopefully, Keystone will be able to deal with the trauma this can cause someone.

    Bob, a block is not such a bad thing. The problem is when they put you on ignore and then have a whole bunch to say when you can't respond. That's downright chicken shit. IT's clear no one is ever going to actually DO anything. It's just grown men spewing words on a forum they will never back up because they can hide behind all sorts of stuff. The problem is, in the real world, many of these things said are great one liners just before the first bunch gets thrown. I see it happen often. Therefore, it is basically a waste of time because no one is going to do anything but continue the tough talk....and it goes on and on. So, in this case, I give Mickey a thumbs up.

  10. #25
    Join Date
    Sep 2017


    Moses, here’s what you’re missing about Mickey (really this is true with anybody) telling the world he’s putting someone on “block“ or “ignore”. You just put yourself in a box if you ever want to respond to (or insult, or troll) that person, which inevitably happens. Also, it lets your adversary know he won, basically you’ve “tapped out”. You’re letting everybody know that person got under your skin. The smart thing to do is just ignore the person and not announce to the world you’re doing it.

    First, let me say your debate skills are exceptional. It's like watching a Varsity player in PE class against the normal students. I agree. If you're going to block. Then block. No need to announce it. I've blocked Zee before, just because I didn't want some of the stuff in my head. I think I blocked T3 a time or two when he was going off the deep end and getting way over my head. But, I don't think I announced it. Wait, before FUDD Bosox catches it. I did list it in my signature because I was mocking 21Forme who started the tradition.

    Also, when someone says they put someone else on block or ignore, we all know that hasn’t really happened. Why? Because people are too curious to ever really put someone on ignore or block. Take Mickey for example. After I made my post yesterday (the one you re-posted on Zenzone), Mickey commented on it within 10 minutes, but in a somewhat abstract way. You could tell my post hit a nerve with him, and he needed to respond. But he couldn’t admit he read my post because he had already told everybody he had me on block.

    Mickey is far different than most posters. HE is a good ole boy. Not exactly built for debate criteria, but still a genuine, honest, and good guy. The real deal IMO.
    I like the fact that Mickey stands for what he believes in and doesn't let others influence his thought process. OR pick sides.

    This is the same situation with the people over on BJTF. There are several that are always claiming to put someone on ignore, but they always end up responding to that person‘s post. An example is 21forme putting Zee on ignore but always responding to him. It makes those claiming to put people on block and ignore lose credibility and look stupid when they do this.

    Can't compare Mickey to 21Forme. I seriously doubt 21Forme could find his own pecker. And IF he did. It would probably scare him.

    So to recap: Here is my advice for all those people that don’t care for a certain poster. Just ignore them, don’t give them them the satisfaction they’ve won by letting everybody know you’ve “tapped out”.

    Can't argue that point. So I'm putting you on ignore. Seriously, good advice. I can't blame people for "tapping out" against you. Maybe you should debate with one hand tied behind your back.
    Last edited by Moses; June 23rd, 2019 at 06:12 PM.

  11. #26
    Join Date
    Sep 2017

    Default Boberino is on a roll

    AxelWolf, if you aren’t interested in this topic anymore, then don’t open (or read) the thread. There are obviously quite a few people still interested in it, since these threads have a lot of views and different people continue posting on it, including Rob continuing to support his claims.

    Damn, you're right Bob. Problem is there are less and less topics of interests. Many times I will pull up a new post, read it, and say to myself "aw fuck, why did I read that for"? Like this one, for instance. Just kidding Bob.

    Isn’t this partly what forums are for? To debate topics that various members find interesting. I’ve never understood the mindset of some members who get tired of a topic or thread and then try to shut it down. No one is making anyone read these threads. If you don’t want to read them, quite reading them. It’s that simple! But you shouldn’t try to shut them down.

    Proof you can take the boy out of Kansas but you can't take Kansas out of the man.

    Btw, this is a common practice for many members/APs. It’s not just something that AxelWolf does. It seems like APs as a group are more into censorship than the mainstream public. Whenever an AP doesn’t agree with something or someone, they usually want that member banned or the thread shut down. I’ve had this happen to me many times. I’m glad Dan doesn’t think like this, and he believes in freedom of speech.

    A forum is like a golf course. The participants begin to think they own the course.


    Four! No, FIVE! I love that part. Now you're going to die wearing that stupid little hat.

    To summarize: If people don’t like a thread or a member just block him (like Mickey does) or don’t read the thread. But please stop trying to impose your values on the rest of us.

    You make some very good points. Maybe you should start your own version of the AP manual? Those imposing their values is what a person hates about forums.

    It's also what makes them look and read.
    Last edited by Moses; June 24th, 2019 at 12:26 PM.

  12. #27
    Join Date
    Sep 2017


    As for me, I don’t have a camp. I’m a lone wolf, mostly being attacked by all camps, those on the right, the left, and in the middle. About my only supporter - and it’s only sometimes - is Moses. But hey, when you’re a lone wolf, I’ll take it.

    So I hope this settles the camp discussion once and for all. You win, you got your camp. Good job!

    I wouldn't worry about it too much about camps there Bob. If all BJTF has going for it is Bosox and 21Forgay, it's in a pretty sad state. Dumb and Dumber. To hell with camps Bob. You want to get your own Island. Being a lone wolf isn't so bad. You eat when and what you want to eat. You go to the movie YOU want to see. You don't have to put up with dipshits like 21Forgay and Bosox. Blackjack success requires about 90% isolation. It should be 98%, with all the dipshits lurking around these forums and in casinos. Wannabees, never wases, never will be's, and a few used to be's. But the real deals? Very few. Mostly just pretenders like Bosox and 21Forgay trying to find the front door of their own house.
    Last edited by Moses; Yesterday at 11:23 AM.

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