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Thread: I'm Being Called TRAITOR

  1. #1
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    Default I'm Being Called TRAITOR

    My intentions were pure, but I am now the bad guy. And I am a little P.O.ed.

    In the last 24 hours I have been under attack from all sides. Someone claiming to be associated with shufflemaster, threatening me. AP's, some who I considered friends, pissed at me, for outing a play, calling me traitor. One threatened to reveal my name and address. I am the bad guy.

    But let me tell you how it really went down. I am a card counter. I never claimed to be the brightest bulb in the pack. I dabble in other AP, if it's not too complicated, but mostly I am a card counter. Card counting is how I have supported myself and made the vast majority of my living for 15 years now.

    So as a card counter, I come across a situation that I identified as cheating and bad for blackjack players, card counters and non-card counters (regular players) alike. And I wanted to 1.) expose what I still believe is illegal and cheating and 2.) warn other players, both card counters and regular players.

    So it turns out, there are members in our community that figured this out before me and have found ways to exploit it. AND they are now pissed at me.....calling me a traitor.

    But here's the problem. I didn't come up with this yesterday, out of the blue. I first noticed this months ago and have been collecting data. I didn't want to make such an allegation, without being reasonably sure. And during this time, I have mentioned this several times on various sites, including the first thread I started just over 2 weeks ago, at the same time I contacted a number of AP friends about my concerns.

    So knowing that I was heading down this road, at no time did any of these AP's contact me. Give me a heads up. How about something like "hey you might not want to travel down that road" or "there are players that are exploiting that". So not knowing THAT angle, I did what I did from a card counter / blackjack player point of view, with the goal of protecting card counters and (traditional) blackjack players.

    And I still think someone needs to be looking out for card counters AND non-card counter traditional (ploppy -EV players). Because what this casino, and shufflemaster is doing is illegal. It is illegal and they know it. It is Mindplay all over again.

    BUT, had I know that some in our community were exploiting it....one upping the casino attempt to cheat, I certainly wouldn't have brought it to light. I would have just quietly stopped playing the tables in question.

    So while I am the bad guy here, I think there is blame to go around. All it would have taken was a little heads up from my fellow AP's who could see where I was headed. But NO.... AP's, can't do that. They are so goddam worried about someone finding out about one of their opportunities.

    Spidey writes:

    Moses replies: You've certainly created your own web. THAT didn't take long for history to repeat. Only this time you'd better wake up and stop worrying about newbie's and APs and start worrying about yourself. I would really hate to be in your shoes or an AP in that city right now.

    It's one thing to point out autrocious behavior. It's quite another to point directly to a casino that is doing it. That casino owner wants your ass now. Problem is he may think someone else is you. You brought this all onto yourself. You think 21forme is going to help you? You missed the clue when Norm closed the first thread? What is wrong with you?

    Man...just play the friggin game. Count the friggin cards. And STOP trying impress everyone with your magnanimous bullshit. When will you ever learn?

    Now, if you were playing DD and using a strategy that defines deck composition, then you'd be able to compensate. But with Hi Lo? No way. As I said many times before. They could post the Hi Lo count on a board behind the dealer and it wouldn't make a damn bit of difference.
    Last edited by Moses; July 25th, 2018 at 10:02 AM.

  2. #2
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    Default

    Please describe this is greater detail, including what you believe was the exploit.

  3. #3
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    I think he is saying that we are as a society all in the same boat, right up there on an equal and even keel with casinos managements. Any attempt by someone appearing to live a decent civilized life is nothing more than fabrication, and not possible, at least in Monet's eyes. I like to think that some of us are better than that as we do have options. After all, we do have the ability to think.

    Bosox writes:

    Moses writes: We can have a decent civilized life. But it's not easy. Unlike any other job, sport, or endeavor we get canned for a strong performance.

    The casino is a friend. I don't back down from bullies. But why would I want to start messing with those guys? It's a game you cannot win. So...you take what they give you. Some of these guys are way too caught in the comaraderie and trying to be some sort of a forum savior.

    Screw the newbies. They'll figure it out. Just like we did. Or they won't, and in that case, we are probably doing them a favor.

    But KJ is not only shining the light on himself but now other APs. Just play the damn game and stop trying to be some damn role model to some newbie out there who probably doesn't even exist in the first place.

    Buy Don S book. Buy Norm's software. Study your ass off. Work your ass off to learn the game. Play your ass off within casino tolerance. Get rid of your entitlement issues. And you just MIGHT make a buck or two. Then again? Might not.
    Last edited by Moses; July 25th, 2018 at 12:17 PM.

  4. #4
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    Quote Originally Posted by DDutton View Post
    Please describe this is greater detail, including what you believe was the exploit.
    KJ taking on El Cortez casino because he believes he was cheated by a DD shuffle machine. Going back to BJTF as Spiderman is an absolutely ludicrous notion by both parties. So all is fair in Love and War and blackjack forums?

    Norm, this a medium pitch with the ball coming in like refrigerator. Take the Gal Dang bat off your shoulders.

    KJ doesn't like me. Quite frankly, I've never cared much for him either. He's a drama queen. But I was beginning to repect him for standing up for himself and what he believed in. But to direct the volume of ridicule at Norm and then go back? All is well in the "Norm" al world?

    O hell no, it's off the charts looney tunes.

  5. #5
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    Moses, it is very evident you are displeased with the decision that Spiderman was allowed to return to BJTF. We both know it was not Spiderman's decision to be allowed back. Seems like it was a private matter that the owner of the Domain decided to do. Why are you trying to get the decision reversed? Only Spiderman knows the real reason why he wanted to return, and the rest of us can only speculate. I have read enough of his past post to form a reasonable opinion, and I think it was to help out and educate the newer players. Obviously he has more than enough experience and knowledge that he could easily do without BJTF.

    Bosox writes:

    Moses replies: What will be wil be. But this is absolutely ridiculous. In the short time back, he has already had two threads sent to the disavantage forum and created a scandle. Everyone is so dang worried about educating newbies, we are overlooking our stance with casinos. Buy Don S book. Buy Norm's software. Newbies should be given more credit. Do they really need their hand held that much? I think not. Like a Bosox, if you're going to make it in this Biz, you'd best have some fire and desire. No?

    No AP that can carry his own weight really needs a forum. But it's nice to exchange ideas with intelligent people such as yourself. But damn, leave the drama out.

    BTW. Bosoxer, I see Normster already deleted your post. He don't wike it when u do dat! See what I mean? Looney Tunes.

    Last edited by Moses; July 25th, 2018 at 08:55 PM.

  6. #6
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    Quote Originally Posted by Moses View Post
    Norm, this a medium pitch with the ball coming in like refrigerator. Take the Gal Dang bat off your shoulders.
    .
    Please stop this paranoid crap. If you post this again in the main forum, you will be banned.
    Norm writes ^:

    Moses replies: ...And Wattenbarmitzfah hits a double down the left field line. How did they get all those letters on the back of his jersey? Ahem. Those dark clouds on the horizon are called thunderheads. Might want to stop the thread while your still batting 1000. Or not, considering how well the first one you closed went. If at first your don't succeed...Sha ruud!

  7. #7
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    Quote Originally Posted by "KewlJ, post:
    I do understand it Don. And have actually now read the discussion that Norm tried to hide.

    Here's the problem. You think there is going to be exactly (1) TC of +/-4 every shoe? It is my experience that when that count is achieved, likely just a couple rounds, possible 3 before shuffle, you will see that high count for several rounds....probably until shuffle. Rarely do you see it just 1 round.

    And that being the case then that total percentage of +4/-4 counts is spread out over less shoes, not more. The MAJORITY of shoes, the TC stays between +2 and -2.

    Regardless, as I said, I play this game. @ 60% penetration I see roughly 30% of shoes achieve this number, not 93% as I was seeing with the card clumping ASM's. AND now that the machines in questions have been switched out, guess what, back to 30%, maybe 33%, but no more.

    Wow KJ. You have had your ass handed to you on so many levels with all these threads, sites, and posts. Standing O to the new biggest clown in blackjack.

    So if you're playing 16 decks Double Deck heads up at 60% pen. That's about 200 hands. So you're getting 5 Decks that hit 4+ at some point in the deck. You're getting 5 decks at -4 at some point in the deck. You're getting 6 decks between the 2s.

    Holy crap! You're getting the opportunity to bet large in 5 out of 16 decks. Hopefully, you're smart enugh to spread to two hands.

    So what's the problem? The problem for the 86th time is your fucking HILO count. You're betting into 5 decks rich in 10-A. The problem is when the deck is also rich in 2-4s or 5-7s. Thus your investment just turned into hands of crap. At only 60% pen which is the norm, you have no time to recover. So now you see your upcoming quality hand shuffled away just after the 2-4s or 5-7s came out. You would have had quality if you just waited one more hand.

    Anyway you're a punk assed queer who will never get anything though your head...only in your ass. So keep on losing Nancy boy, I don't give a shit.
    Last edited by Moses; August 1st, 2018 at 09:47 PM.

  8. #8

    Default Friends, buddies, pals

    Moses, I thought you were friends with KJ? What has brewed up between the two of you since I've been MIA?

  9. #9
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    Quote Originally Posted by Blitzkrieg View Post
    Moses, I thought you were friends with KJ? What has brewed up between the two of you since I've been MIA?
    I respect KJ. But I wouldn't say we were ever friends. I'm sure he'd agree. It hit me wrong that he talks all this shit on Norm and then returns under a different name expecting an open arms reception.

    I believe his topic of cheating machines posted on several different forums was going to hurt our pitch games worse. They are barely worth playing as it is. I'm tired of the "save the newbie" mentality. I thought it was self serving and I know could be beat by improving his own game as opposed to destroying our game.

    Anyway, welcome back. IT's good to have some company on the island of NoNorm.
    Last edited by Moses; August 15th, 2018 at 11:51 AM.

  10. #10
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    Default Two kinds of Dumb

    ...the guy that gets naked, run out in the snow, and howls at the moon. The first one don't matter. But when 2nd one starts doing it in your living room, you're kinda forced to deal with it.

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