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Thread: TARZAN's Count

  1. #91
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    Quote Originally Posted by zengrifter View Post
    Not at all. DonS is discussing multi-level counts.
    Multiparameter systems that take into account the bivaluate nature of key cards like 7s, in general, and Tarzan's count in particular,
    are not bound by the linear limits of multlevel counts. Were you confused about the difference between multilevel and multiparameter?
    What multiparameters? It still groups cards instead of tracking individual ranks. Why don't you quantify it if you are so familiar with it?

    Even if sky is the limit, how does one know that the indices he worked out are the correct ones?

  2. #92

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    Quote Originally Posted by fat_bumblebee View Post
    What multiparameters? It still groups cards instead of tracking individual ranks. Why don't you quantify it if you are so familiar with it?

    Even if sky is the limit, how does one know that the indices he worked out are the correct ones?
    I cannot respond specifically to the Tarzan count, my experience is with the multi-parameter approach, which bears some synergistic applicability with the conventional balanced counts. With a multiparameter approach, using the single most valuable bivaluate card (7s) - a side count of 7s is kept and a running assessment of the relative excess or deficiency of such per 1/4, 1/2, or full deck. This information is used to play stiffs, example:

    If I detect two extra 7s per deck and I'm holding 14 v 10 I can add/subtract 10 from my play index in that moment:
    if my play index for standing 14 v 10 is +6, I can adjust in that moment and take the hit with a TC as high as +15, for example.

    Here is Michael Hall's adaptation of multiparameter adjustment for HiOpt-1 (the adjustment for 7s would be equally valid for HiLo)

    As I understand the Tarzan approach, it is different than the multiparameter sidecount augmentation but achieves similar effect.

    Refer also to Griffin's TOB page 58.
    "The dogs bark but the caravan moves on."
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  3. #93
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    With all those things throwing around, no one can answer the simple question: how much is it worth?

  4. #94

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    Quote Originally Posted by fat_bumblebee View Post
    With all those things throwing around, no one can answer the simple question: how much is it worth?
    As Automonk has pointed out, maybe an extra 10%, improves the PE, substantially, but not the BC.
    "The dogs bark but the caravan moves on."
    .....................The Zengrifter Interview (PDF) |
    The Zengrifter / James Grosjean Reputation Debate
    -----------------------------------------
    “Truth, like gold, is obtained not by growth, but by washing away all that is not gold.” — Leo Tolstoy........
    "Is everything a conspiracy? No, just the important stuff." ZG

  5. #95
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    So the best someone can say is "maybe"? How about maybe not?

  6. #96

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    Quote Originally Posted by fat_bumblebee View Post
    So the best someone can say is "maybe"? How about maybe not?
    YES. Very likely NOT, presuming one lacks the superior mental dexterity of Lady Tthree.
    Others employing such schemes, even just a ace sidecount to enhance betting in ace-neutral counts like HO-2,
    are just working harder to achieve the same net result.
    "The dogs bark but the caravan moves on."
    .....................The Zengrifter Interview (PDF) |
    The Zengrifter / James Grosjean Reputation Debate
    -----------------------------------------
    “Truth, like gold, is obtained not by growth, but by washing away all that is not gold.” — Leo Tolstoy........
    "Is everything a conspiracy? No, just the important stuff." ZG

  7. #97
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    Quote Originally Posted by zengrifter View Post
    YES. Very likely NOT, presuming one lacks the superior mental dexterity of Lady Tthree.
    Others employing such schemes, even just a ace sidecount to enhance betting in ace-neutral counts like HO-2,
    are just working harder to achieve the same net result.
    It will definitely take much more that the average 1 or 2 level count. Whether it's worth it depends a lot on the person using it. I like the idea that it's plays frequently deviate from what one would expect from HiLo or other popular system. It's like having built in camo up to a point. I wonder, Tarzan, do you ever use "camo" when playing your count. I assume you use it mostly as a play all system with wonging out, or am I wrong?
    Aslan 11/1/90 - 6/15/10 Stormy 1/22/95 -8/23/10
    “There are not one hundred people in the United States who hate The Catholic Church,
    but there are millions who hate what they wrongly perceive the Catholic Church to be.”
    Bishop Fulton J. Sheen

    “It takes a very long time to become young.” Pablo Picasso

  8. #98

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    Quote Originally Posted by fat_bumblebee View Post
    With all those things throwing around, no one can answer the simple question: how much is it worth?
    The only way to know that is to ask yourself, how much time are you willing to invest in learning and employing the system in the casino?

  9. #99
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    The bumblebee wants the key to the kingdom? Lol......funny

    Mac
    So look buddy it's nothing personal, but either your the unluckiest person in the world or your stealing from me. Either way............ I WANT NO PART OF YOU!!!!!! NEVER!!!!

  10. #100
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    Quote Originally Posted by Blitzkrieg View Post
    The only way to know that is to ask yourself, how much time are you willing to invest in learning and employing the system in the casino?
    How much time I am willing to invest depends on the benefit which is currently unknown. As a result I am willing to invest zero time.

  11. #101
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    Quote Originally Posted by Machinist View Post
    The bumblebee wants the key to the kingdom? Lol......funny

    Mac
    What kingdom? I'm not delusional.

  12. #102
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    Quote Originally Posted by fat_bumblebee View Post
    What kingdom? I'm not delusional.
    There, there, I understand. Relax.
    Aslan 11/1/90 - 6/15/10 Stormy 1/22/95 -8/23/10
    “There are not one hundred people in the United States who hate The Catholic Church,
    but there are millions who hate what they wrongly perceive the Catholic Church to be.”
    Bishop Fulton J. Sheen

    “It takes a very long time to become young.” Pablo Picasso

  13. #103
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    Hey! What was that for?
    Aslan 11/1/90 - 6/15/10 Stormy 1/22/95 -8/23/10
    “There are not one hundred people in the United States who hate The Catholic Church,
    but there are millions who hate what they wrongly perceive the Catholic Church to be.”
    Bishop Fulton J. Sheen

    “It takes a very long time to become young.” Pablo Picasso

  14. #104
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    Quote Originally Posted by aslan View Post
    It will definitely take much more that the average 1 or 2 level count. Whether it's worth it depends a lot on the person using it. I like the idea that it's plays frequently deviate from what one would expect from HiLo or other popular system. It's like having built in camo up to a point. I wonder, Tarzan, do you ever use "camo" when playing your count. I assume you use it mostly as a play all system with wonging out, or am I wrong?
    You'd be surprised how little they do deviate. In BJA3 Schlesinger gives two numbers at the end of every line of play values, ss and m(n). ss is the sum of the squares of the value of every card, and m(n) is how far off the play is from basic strategy. Divide ss by m(n), multiply it by four for dealer 10's because you see them 10 times more often, and that gives you the approximate relative value of the index play. For most plays, the value just isn't there, no matter which cards you count or how. Like trying to make a dollar out of 15 cents.

  15. #105
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    Quote Originally Posted by Automatic Monkey View Post
    You'd be surprised how little they do deviate. In BJA3 Schlesinger gives two numbers at the end of every line of play values, ss and m(n). ss is the sum of the squares of the value of every card, and m(n) is how far off the play is from basic strategy. Divide ss by m(n), multiply it by four for dealer 10's because you see them 10 times more often, and that gives you the approximate relative value of the index play. For most plays, the value just isn't there, no matter which cards you count or how. Like trying to make a dollar out of 15 cents.
    makes me think of the variations of strategy when hc information is available. which is also dependent upon certainty or precision of said information, sorta thing. perhaps Tarzan might make deviations in hc strategy as well, i guess?
    best regards,
    mr fr0g MMOA honorary predator
    STRENGTH - HONOR - HEART
    that's my take on it your mileage may vary.
    for senior citizen fuzzy count click link:
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