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Thread: “The Third Jesus: The Christ We Cannot Ignore”

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    Default “The Third Jesus: The Christ We Cannot Ignore”

    A good attempt at reconciling the man, the myth, and the Self >>

    Who Is Deepak Chopra’s 'Third Jesus'?
    An excerpt from “The Third Jesus: The Christ We Cannot Ignore




    Jesus is in trouble. When people worship him today — or even speak his name — the object of their devotion is unlikely to be who they think he is. A mythical Jesus has grown up over time. He has served to divide peoples and nations. He has led to destructive wars in the name of religious fantasies. The legacy of love found in the New Testament has been tainted with the worst sort of intolerance and prejudice that would have appalled Jesus in life. Most troubling of all, his teachings have been hijacked by people who hate in the name of love.

    "Sometimes I feel this social pressure to return to my faith," a lapsed Catholic told me recently, "but I'm too bitter. Can I love a religion that calls gays sinners but hides pedophiles in its clergy? Yesterday while I was driving to work, I heard a rock song that went, 'Jesus walked on water when he should have surfed,' and you know what? I burst out laughing. I would never have done that when I was younger. Now I feel only the smallest twinge of guilt."

    No matter where you look, a cloud of confusion hangs over the message of Jesus. To cut through it we have to be specific about who we mean when we refer to Jesus. One Jesus is historical, and we know next to nothing about him. Another Jesus is the one appropriated by Christianity. He was created by the Church to fulfill its agenda. The third Jesus, the one this book is about, is as yet so unknown that even the most devout Christians don't suspect that he exists. Yet he is the Christ we cannot — and must not — ignore.

    Redeeming the Redeemer

    The first Jesus was a rabbi who wandered the shores of northern Galilee many centuries ago. This Jesus still feels close enough to touch. He appears in our mind's eye dressed in homespun but haloed in glory. He was kind, serene, peaceful, loving, and yet he was the keeper of deep mysteries.

    This historical Jesus has been lost, however, swept away by history. He still lingers like a ghost, a projection of all the ideal qualities we wish for in ourselves but so painfully lack.

    >> CONTINUE TO PAGE-2
    Last edited by zengrifter; January 24th, 2010 at 07:26 PM.
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    See also -
    "The dogs bark but the caravan moves on."
    .....................The Zengrifter Interview (PDF) |
    The Zengrifter / James Grosjean Reputation Debate
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    “Truth, like gold, is obtained not by growth, but by washing away all that is not gold.” — Leo Tolstoy........
    "Is everything a conspiracy? No, just the important stuff." ZG

  3. #3

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    Dead Sea Scrolls prove Bible unoriginal

    Sunday, 24 January 2010
    Acharya S


    "They speak of a Teacher of Righteousness and a pierced messiah,
    of cleansing through water and a battle of light against darkness.




    "But anyone looking to the Dead Sea Scrolls in search of proof, say, that Jesus of Nazareth was the messiah presaged by the prophets, or that John the Baptist lived among the scroll's authors, will be disappointed."

    News items are circulating about how "hints" and "insights" contained in the famous Dead Sea Scrolls discovered in caves near the ancient site of Qumran can be found in the Bible. In other words, certain ideas in the scrolls also appear in the New Testament, meaning, of course, that the impression of Christianity as a "divine revelation" appearing whole cloth miraculously from the very finger of God is clearly erroneous.

    Few scholars today claim that any of the Dead Sea Scrolls ("DSS") date to the time after Christianity was allegedly founded by a "historical" Jesus in the first century of the common era. Indeed, it is agreed that most of the scrolls pre-date the turn of the era and that none of them show any knowledge of Jesus Christ or Christianity.

    In my book The Christ Conspiracy, I demonstrate that Christianity is an amalgam of the many religions, sects, cults and brotherhood traditions of the Mediterranean and beyond. One of the major influences on Christianity is that of Jews, obviously, including those mentioned in the New Testament, i.e., the Pharisees and Sadducees. Ancient Jewish historian Josephus also mentions the sect of the Essenes, who are traditionally associated with Qumran, in a "by default" argument. However, scholar Solomon Schecter - who discovered a scroll at Cairo that was later found at Qumran - points to a heretical sect of Sadducees or Zadokites, as they are called in both the Bible and DSS. In The Christ Conspiracy, I discuss this Zadokite origin of the DSS and this group's obvious influence on the New Testament.

    What this rumination all means, of course, is that Christianity is, as I contend in my books, largely unoriginal, representing not fresh and new "divine revelation" but, again, the amalgamation of not only the ideas of the Zadokite authors of the Dead Sea Scrolls but also influences from the Essenes, Jews, Samaritans and many others.

    MORE- http://freethoughtnation.com/index.p...tid=45:general
    "The dogs bark but the caravan moves on."
    .....................The Zengrifter Interview (PDF) |
    The Zengrifter / James Grosjean Reputation Debate
    -----------------------------------------
    “Truth, like gold, is obtained not by growth, but by washing away all that is not gold.” — Leo Tolstoy........
    "Is everything a conspiracy? No, just the important stuff." ZG

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    Default How many Jesus' are there?

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    There is only one Jesus, but Katweezels are a dime a dozen. az
    Aslan 11/1/90 - 6/15/10 Stormy 1/22/95 -8/23/10
    “There are not one hundred people in the United States who hate The Catholic Church,
    but there are millions who hate what they wrongly perceive the Catholic Church to be.”
    Bishop Fulton J. Sheen

    “It takes a very long time to become young.” Pablo Picasso

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    Quote Originally Posted by zengrifter View Post
    Jesus is in trouble. When people worship him today — or even speak his name — the object of their devotion is unlikely to be who they think he is. A mythical Jesus has grown up over time. He has served to divide peoples and nations. He has led to destructive wars in the name of religious fantasies. The legacy of love found in the New Testament has been tainted with the worst sort of intolerance and prejudice that would have appalled Jesus in life. Most troubling of all, his teachings have been hijacked by people who hate in the name of love.
    Talk about unadulterated nonsense!
    Aslan 11/1/90 - 6/15/10 Stormy 1/22/95 -8/23/10
    “There are not one hundred people in the United States who hate The Catholic Church,
    but there are millions who hate what they wrongly perceive the Catholic Church to be.”
    Bishop Fulton J. Sheen

    “It takes a very long time to become young.” Pablo Picasso

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    Quote Originally Posted by zengrifter View Post
    Dead Sea Scrolls prove Bible unoriginal

    Can't you come up with something better than that? Or are you saying that the Bible comes right out of mainstream Jewish thought and is therefore both genuine and true?
    Aslan 11/1/90 - 6/15/10 Stormy 1/22/95 -8/23/10
    “There are not one hundred people in the United States who hate The Catholic Church,
    but there are millions who hate what they wrongly perceive the Catholic Church to be.”
    Bishop Fulton J. Sheen

    “It takes a very long time to become young.” Pablo Picasso

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    Default The Jesus wars

    Quote Originally Posted by aslan View Post
    Talk about unadulterated nonsense!
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by zengrifter View Post
    "Jesus is in trouble. When people worship him today — or even speak his name — the object of their devotion is unlikely to be who they think he is. A mythical Jesus has grown up over time. He has served to divide peoples and nations. He has led to destructive wars in the name of religious fantasies. The legacy of love found in the New Testament has been tainted with the worst sort of intolerance and prejudice that would have appalled Jesus in life. Most troubling of all, his teachings have been hijacked by people who hate in the name of love."
    (Aslan reply Talk about unadulterated nonsense!
    __________________
    Here below is a list of your unadulterated nonsense concerning ..."he has led to destructive wars in the name of religious fantasies..." (taken from above.) If this list is not enough for you, I have more; as this only covers 174 years.

    The Crusades

    History Learning Site > Medieval England > The Crusades

    What were the Crusades?

    The Crusades were a series of military campaigns during the time of Medieval England against the Muslims of the Middle East. In 1076, the Muslims had captured Jerusalem - the most holy of holy places for Christians. Jesus had been born in nearby Bethlehem and Jesus had spent most of his life in Jerusalem. He was crucified on Calvary Hill, also in Jerusalem. There was no more important place on Earth than Jerusalem for a true Christian which is why Christians called Jerusalem the "City of God".

    However, Jerusalem was also extremely important for the Muslims as Muhammad, the founder of the Muslim faith, had been there and there was great joy in the Muslim world when Jerusalem was captured. A beautiful dome - called the Dome of the Rock - was built on the rock where Muhammad was said to have sat and prayed and it was so holy that no Muslim was allowed to tread on the rock or touch it when visiting the Dome.

    Therefore the Christian fought to get Jerusalem back while the Muslims fought to keep Jerusalem. These wars were to last nearly 200 years

    A Time line of the Crusades

    Some History books do slightly vary with their dates regarding when the Crusades started. The problem seems to be on deciding whether the date a crusade was called for is the date it started, on or whether the date troops actually left for a crusade is the date it started.

    The First Crusade : 1096 to 1099

    The Second Crusade : 1147 to 1149

    The Third Crusade : 1189 to 1192

    The Fourth Crusade : 1201 to 1204

    The Fifth Crusade : 1218 to 1221

    The Sixth Crusade : 1228 to 1229

    The Seventh Crusade : 1248 to 1254

    The Eighth Crusade : 1270


    In 1212 what became known as the Children’s Crusade also occurred. (Which some have called the ninth crusade.)
    Last edited by Katweezel; January 26th, 2010 at 10:27 PM. Reason: zPapal edict
    Dogma schmogma

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    Gee, I mistakenly thought that the Muslims (Mohammedans) had taken many countries and territories by force of violence and that the West was only taking back what was rightfully theirs. Also, the Holy City was part of the reason and a pretty good one at that.
    Aslan 11/1/90 - 6/15/10 Stormy 1/22/95 -8/23/10
    “There are not one hundred people in the United States who hate The Catholic Church,
    but there are millions who hate what they wrongly perceive the Catholic Church to be.”
    Bishop Fulton J. Sheen

    “It takes a very long time to become young.” Pablo Picasso

  10. #10

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    Quote Originally Posted by aslan View Post
    Gee, I mistakenly thought that the Muslims (Mohammedans) had taken many countries and territories by force of violence and that the West was only taking back what was rightfully theirs. Also, the Holy City was part of the reason and a pretty good one at that.
    What was really the bottomline here? I always thought that the Crusades were a religious war instigated by the Vatican to convert and/or kill infidels. zg
    "The dogs bark but the caravan moves on."
    .....................The Zengrifter Interview (PDF) |
    The Zengrifter / James Grosjean Reputation Debate
    -----------------------------------------
    “Truth, like gold, is obtained not by growth, but by washing away all that is not gold.” — Leo Tolstoy........
    "Is everything a conspiracy? No, just the important stuff." ZG

  11. #11

    Default Your history's a bit off

    Quote Originally Posted by aslan View Post
    Gee, I mistakenly thought . . . that the West was only taking back what was rightfully theirs. Also, the Holy City was part of the reason and a pretty good one at that.
    Actually, the Romans followed Alexander and forcefully occupied most the lands of Asia Minor and on into parts of the Middle East (Mesopotamia) and North Africa. The Western Christian Church was established in Italy whereas the Byzantine, Eastern Christian Church was in Constantinople. So it's not clear what your reference to the "West" even means,----Anatolia was always viewed as distinct from Roman Italy. In any case, Pope Urban responded to a request from the Byzantine Emperor in 1095 for assistance in pushing back the Muslim Turks, not specifically to reclaim Jerusalem. Over time Catholic Christianity kept Islam from overwhelming Europe but Greek Orthodoxy failed to do so. As to who these lands "rightfully belonged" to, I submit it was the people whose ancestry derived from those regions, who spoke local languages and dialects, etc. not to the occupying armies and political apparatus. Whatever religions those local people adopted over time----Roman paganism, Judaism, Christianity, Islam (through peaceful integration and/or occupation) really seems to have nothing to say about who the land "rightfully" belongs to. But we know these are affairs of geopolitical power; not matters of what is "right." It's like saying the Black Hills rightfully belongs to the US government rather than the people from whom it was taken. There is a similar cynical claim of "rightful ownership" coming from the Spanish government in denying salvage rights to the discoverers of sunken gold bullion mined in Peru. That lucre rightfully belongs to the native people who were forced to extract it from their traditional lands, but we know that's not going to happen.
    Last edited by Diver; January 27th, 2010 at 01:58 PM. Reason: grammar

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    Quote Originally Posted by zengrifter View Post
    What was really the bottomline here? I always thought that the Crusades were a religious war instigated by the Vatican to convert and/or kill infidels. zg
    Funny, I never heard that one. I guess we travel in different circles.
    Aslan 11/1/90 - 6/15/10 Stormy 1/22/95 -8/23/10
    “There are not one hundred people in the United States who hate The Catholic Church,
    but there are millions who hate what they wrongly perceive the Catholic Church to be.”
    Bishop Fulton J. Sheen

    “It takes a very long time to become young.” Pablo Picasso

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    Quote Originally Posted by Diver View Post
    Actually, the Romans followed Alexander and forcefully occupied most the lands of Asia Minor and on into parts of the Middle East (Mesopotamia) and North Africa. The Western Christian Church was established in Italy whereas the Byzantine, Eastern Christian Church was in Constantinople. So it's not clear what your reference to the "West" even means,----Anatolia was always viewed as distinct from Roman Italy. In any case, Pope Urban responded to a request from the Byzantine Emperor in 1095 for assistance in pushing back the Muslim Turks, not specifically to reclaim Jerusalem. Over time Catholic Christianity kept Islam from overwhelming Europe but Greek Orthodoxy failed to do so. As to who these lands "rightfully belonged" to, I submit it was the people whose ancestry derived from those regions, who spoke local languages and dialects, etc. not to the occupying armies and political apparatus. Whatever religions those local people adopted over time----Roman paganism, Judaism, Christianity, Islam (through peaceful integration and/or occupation) really seems to have nothing to say about who the land "rightfully" belongs to. But we know these are affairs of geopolitical power; not matters of what is "right." It's like saying the Black Hills rightfully belongs to the US government rather than the people from whom it was taken. There is a similar cynical claim of "rightful ownership" coming from the Spanish government in denying salvage rights to the discoverers of sunken gold bullion mined in Peru. That lucre rightfully belongs to the native people who were forced to extract it from their traditional lands, but we know that's not going to happen.
    I believe that many of the lands taken by force by Islam were Christian. The people either had to convert, die or leave. The Byzantine Church you mentioned I believe was under the Papacy even as it is today. Maybe West is the wrong term--how about Christendom?
    Aslan 11/1/90 - 6/15/10 Stormy 1/22/95 -8/23/10
    “There are not one hundred people in the United States who hate The Catholic Church,
    but there are millions who hate what they wrongly perceive the Catholic Church to be.”
    Bishop Fulton J. Sheen

    “It takes a very long time to become young.” Pablo Picasso

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    Default THREE Jesus's?

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  15. #15

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    There is a fourth -

    "The dogs bark but the caravan moves on."
    .....................The Zengrifter Interview (PDF) |
    The Zengrifter / James Grosjean Reputation Debate
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    “Truth, like gold, is obtained not by growth, but by washing away all that is not gold.” — Leo Tolstoy........
    "Is everything a conspiracy? No, just the important stuff." ZG

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